Zappable
By Ariel Krakowski
80% of School Is a Waste of Time - Will AI Change It? (With Bryan Caplan)
Read an abridged transcript here.
Bryan Caplan argues that roughly 80% of schooling is wasted time, and that the primary value of a degree comes from signaling - demonstrating intelligence, conscientiousness, and conformity to employers rather than building useful skills. In this conversation, we discuss the evidence behind that claim, what "conformity" really means, why the system is so resistant to change, what Bryan would do if he was in charge, and whether AI will change the equilibrium.
Some questions we discuss:
- How much does education actually increase abilities or intelligence?
- The Flynn effect points to an increase in IQ scores over time. Do schools get any credit ?
- Bryan has argued that a college degree is important for signaling conformity and skipping it demonstrates non-conformity. But if conformity just means "professionalism" - can you demonstrate it without a degree?
- Classes are no longer entirely in-person, and tech will change education even more. Will people still need a four-year degree from a brick-and-mortar institution?
- What happens to universities once AI can do most intellectual work?
Guest: Bryan Caplan, Economics professor at George Mason University and author of The Case Against Education. Check out his Substack and YouTube Channel.
Timestamps
00:00 How Much of School is a Waste?
04:39 The Flynn Effect
08:29 The Importance of Literacy & Numeracy
12:35 Signaling and Conformity in Education
18:57 The Practicality of College Education
20:41 Will Online Education Become Accepted?
25:28 AI's Impact on Education
29:50 Will AI Asymptote
32:11 Reimagining the Education System
35:27 Curiosity and Tailored Learning
37:12 Talented STEM Students
40:16 Libertarian Perspectives on Education
Drawing the Line with AI
Ariel speaks with Mike Todasco about practical AI usage strategies and broader implications of AI adoption. Mike shares his "Borg Chart" framework for organizing AI tools, explains how he uses multiple AI subscriptions, and discusses his recent research on LLMs and prediction markets. The conversation covers where to draw the line with AI assistance, the risks of over-reliance on AI companions, how education needs to adapt, and how solopreneurs are now empowered with AI.
Guest
Michael (Mike) Todasco is a Visiting Fellow at San Diego State University’s AI Center and the former Senior Director of Innovation at Paypal. Find him online at todasco.com.
Chapters
00:00 Introduction to AI and Personal Journey
03:12 AI Borg Chart
05:01 Human Touch vs. AI Automation
07:52 Exploring Multiple AI Tools
11:57 Recognizing AI Errors & Limitations
15:32 Using Deep Research
19:09 AI Betting & Confidence
24:38 The Risks of AI
28:20 AI in Education
32:23 The Purpose of Learning
37:51 AI Alignment and Corporate Alignment
44:18 The GDPVal Metric
The Science of Optimal Experience: Understanding Flow with Dr. Orin Davis
In this conversation, Ariel interviews Dr. Orin Davis to explore the science of "Flow" - the state of complete immersion and energized focus often described as "being in the zone". Orin breaks down the characteristics of flow, its relationship with happiness, and how to identify the activities that help you cultivate it. They discuss the differences between flow and meditation and offer a critical look at how modern schools and workplaces may inhibit optimal performance. They explore real-world examples of flow in tennis, chess, coding, and dancing. Finally, they discuss "microflow" - salvaging optimal experiences in short bursts even under suboptimal conditions.
Guest
Dr. Orin Davis studied under Mihaly Csikszentmihalyi and is holder of the first doctorate awarded in Positive Psychology, a lecturer at Columbia University, and Principal Investigator of the Quality of Life Laboratory. You can find more about his work at qllab.org.
Timestamps
00:00 Introduction to Positive Psychology and Flow
01:49 Understanding Flow: Definition and Characteristics
04:22 The Spectrum of Flow Experiences
06:02 Flow and Happiness
07:49 Frequency and Spillover Effects of Flow
10:06 The Nature of Flow: Struggle and Enjoyment
12:59 Flow vs. Mastery: Short-term vs. Long-term Satisfaction
14:40 Flow and Meditation: Similarities and Differences
17:48 Effort and Enjoyment: The Balance in Flow
20:21 The Importance of Doing for Its Own Sake
22:48 Work-Life Balance and the Startup Culture
27:32 Cultivating Flow: Tips and Strategies
30:08 The Art of Collaboration in Dance
31:01 Flow in Physical vs. Intellectual Activities
33:33 The Impact of Distractions on Flow
36:46 Rethinking Education for Flow Experiences
40:11 Grouping in Schools and Flow Opportunities
44:20 Understanding Microflow
48:03 Flow When Playing Chess & Volleyball
53:40 Benefits of Microflow in Daily Life
58:19 Creating Opportunities for Flow at Work
The Elephant in the Brain, Ems & LLMs with Robin Hanson
In this wide-ranging conversation, Ariel interviews economist Robin Hanson about the hidden motives that drive human behavior, the central theme of his book The Elephant in the Brain. Hanson argues that much of what we do is not for the reasons we consciously believe, but rather for signaling our value as allies, mates, and group members. Our conscious mind acts as a "press secretary," creating socially acceptable narratives for our actions, while the real, often selfish, motives remain hidden. Hanson illustrates this thesis with examples from medicine, charity, and art, contending that our actions in these domains are better explained by a desire to signal care, loyalty, and status than by the stated goals of health, altruism, or aesthetic appreciation.
The conversation then shifts to the implications of this theory and the rise of Artificial Intelligence. Hanson suggests that while individuals can only make modest changes to their ingrained behaviors, society can foster more rationality by creating institutions like prediction markets. They discuss the implications of AI on human value creation and the future of work in an AI-driven economy. Hanson places the latest AI technology within the overall context of AI booms and busts, and revisits his analysis from The Age of Em. Hanson is less worried about AI risk than many, but appreciates modern AI as a powerful research tool for integrating knowledge across disciplines. They discuss the potential influence of AI on art and culture, emphasizing the unpredictable nature of artistic expression.
Guest: Robin Hanson, economist at George Mason University, author of The Age of Em and co-author of The Elephant in the Brain, and writer at the blog Overcoming Bias.
Timestamps
00:00 Understanding Motivations: The Drive to Explore
04:06 The Elephant in the Brain: Unpacking Hidden Motivations
07:43 Controversial Insights: Medicine and Health
15:14 Signaling and Status: The Social Dynamics of Behavior
24:30 Behavior Beyond Signaling: Exploring Basic Drives
28:29 The Role of Constants in Human Behavior
29:33 Signaling in Art and Consumption
30:58 Uniqueness and Social Preferences
34:11 Distal vs. Proximate Explanations of Behavior
36:30 The Nature of Helping Behavior
37:16 Effective Altruism and Individual Behavior
38:54 Understanding Human Behavior and Policy
41:25 Individual Change vs. Societal Change
43:00 Institutions and Rational Decision-Making
45:31 Betting Markets and Prediction Accuracy
49:09 AI's Impact on Human Value and Signaling
52:38 The Future of Work in an AI-Driven Economy
55:34 The Human-Like Evolution of AI
58:23 The Near View vs. Far View of AI
59:52 Investment Cycles in AI Development
01:01:46 Paths to Artificial Intelligence: Ems vs. LLMs
01:02:41 The Challenge of Regulating AI Development
01:05:25 Knowledge Spread and Its Risks
01:07:46 The Future of AI and Personal Investment
01:09:29 AI as a Tool for Integration and Discovery
01:14:05 The Impact of AI on Art and Culture
Meditation and The Mind Illuminated with Matthew Immergut
In this conversation, Ariel speaks with Matthew Immergut, an associate professor of sociology and co-author of the acclaimed guide to meditation "The Mind Illuminated'. They dive deep into the nature of meditation, moving beyond the pop-culture view of it as a simple tool for relaxation. Matthew shares his journey into meditation, discussing its nature, goals, and the challenges faced by practitioners. He emphasizes the distinction between meditation as a formal practice and meditative activities, the importance of attention and awareness, and the potential for insights gained through meditation. Matthew provides practical advice for both beginners who are skeptical and for practitioners who have hit a plateau, and emphasizes the importance of joy in meditation. He discusses how there is no "silver bullet" for self-transformation, and the evolving gifts of meditation over time. They also discuss the role of neuroscience in understanding meditation, the balance between concentration and insight, the paradox of "letting go," and the complex relationship between meditative states and a person's everyday behavior.
Topics with Timestamps:
00:00 Introduction to Meditation and Background
04:34 Secular vs. Spiritual Approaches to Meditation
07:30 The Purpose of Meditation: Beyond Self-Improvement
10:33 Defining Meditation: Formal Practice vs. Meditative Activities
11:49 Training the Mind: Skills and Intentions in Meditation
14:01 Experiential Curiosity: Insights from Meditation
19:07 Skepticism, Setting Small Goals and Finding Enjoyment
25:27 Navigating Plateaus in Meditation Practice and Appreciating Noticing
29:43 The Role of Teachers in Meditation
31:27 Meditation: Universal Necessity or Personal Choice?
37:52 The Evolving Gifts of Meditation
39:46 Personal Journeys: From Orthodox Judaism to Meditation
45:01 The Mind Illuminated: Understanding Attention and Awareness
48:54 Meditation and Neuroscience
54:26 Shamatha & Vipassana, Insights and Awakening
1:01:21 Direct Approaches to Awareness
1:04:56 States vs. Traits in Meditation
01:09:00 Practical Meditation Tips and Finding Balance
The Philosophy of Stoicism: Agency, Reason, and Human Nature
In this episode Ariel explores Stoic philosophy and ethics with Jula Wildberger, Professor Emerita of Classics at the American University of Paris.
Professor Wildberger discusses:
• The core Stoic idea of human agency and what is truly good
• The Stoic belief in living according to one's own nature
• The Stoic view on emotions: distinguishing between involuntary reactions, harmful "passions", and the sage's "eupatheiai"
• How "Indifferents" like health or wealth are neither truly good nor bad, but are still relevant to virtue
• The importance of sociability as a fundamental human characteristic
• The challenges of applying ancient Stoicism, considering its original physical and metaphysical underpinnings
• How Stoic principles can still offer practical value today
Computational Neuroscience, Connectomics, and Consciousness
In this inaugural episode, Ariel sits down with Toviah Moldwin, PhD, to explore computational neuroscience. They discuss the similarities and differences between how biological brains and current AI models function and learn. They tackle the question of brain efficiency, particularly in language acquisition, debating the roles of innate biological structures versus learning from data, comparing it to the vast data needs of AI models. Next, Toviah provides an introduction to the field of connectomics – the detailed mapping of neural connections, and also discusses the complexity of single neurons. Finally, they discuss the hard problem of consciousness: can science explain it and can AI attain it?